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Help and Advice - Land Lady refusing to give back deposit! What can I do?

Started by mrseany, November 08, 2011, 03:06:01 PM

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mrseany

I want to make this as accurate as possible so I can receive the best piece of advice from the wise and experienced people that access this website.

On Feb 2009, I moved into a property with two other people. We signed a 12 month contract and paid our deposit of £1,800 to a letting agent.

One year after two of the three people moved out and I managed to get other people in to fill their place. The land lady knew about this but there was no alterations to the contract to include them. When the house mates moved out they were given the money paid by the new tenants to make up for their deposits. This was reoccurring each time a new tenant moved in. The land lady told me that she was not using the letting agency any more after the 12 months were up and I did not sign any new contract. I never had any more contact with them.

Long story short, I ended up staying in the property for two years and 9 months and was never asked to renew the contract at any time in this period. In total there was 11 people who came to stay at the property in all that time, sometimes only for a few months at a time.

As the original house mate I felt responsible to ensure that the house was always in a high standard and that everyone paid their rent on time. About 2 years into living at the property the land lady said that one months rent was missing and that she had checked her excel spreadsheet but was unsure who did not pay (as most of the payments had been made over the counter at various banks). I disputed that one whole month could just not have been paid and she was adamant.

As I was responsible (or at least felt I was as the original tenant) I said that I would try and make up for the loss and repay it to her. She even knocked money off it. I never seen a copy of the spread sheet.

As time went on we were asked to move out of the property due to subsidence. By the time we had to move out I could not get hold of the land lady as she was going through a bereavement so her partner was dealing with the issue.

He stated that after we moved out there was a total of over £2,000 that was not paid and we wouldn't be getting back our deposit. It is just not possible to work out who owed rent and on what dates due to the chaotic way the rent was paid by the tenants. In the end, I had to pay the remaining housemates their deposits back out of my own money so I am now left stuck. Their names were not on the contract, however I felt a responsibility to make sure they were not left short.

Also upon moving in we were given something to sign to give back to the land lady regarding the condition of the property and on moving out I found it. I never signed it nor did I give it back to the land lady. She did not request it.

Recently when we moved out on Sep 4th 2011, her partner was doing an inventory of the property (with someone from the company who inspected that everything was still in place and there was no damage etc) and he accused me of cutting up the carpet to hide stuff under and then had attempted to sew it back together again. I was furious. I have since gone back to the property and had a look and the reality is that it's a scrape along the carpet where furniture had been moved. Absolute ludacris claims. Anyway even if there was damage I still have in my procession the inventory that I never signed.

Its now more than two months later and I have had no communication from the land lady despite text messages and have spoken to her partner to get access to the property to retrieve mail.

I have never received the spreadsheet of where it states rent has not been paid.

I know you are thinking why did I pay those people their deposits if it was not my responsibility. Well I felt bad for them and didn't feel they deserved to be deprived of their money back when they had done nothing wrong.

I rang the letting agent today and a member of staff said that I am still down on their books that I am residing in the property. The gentleman said that he would speak to the landlady and get back to me.

I just want to ask you if I am eligible to receive the whole deposit if I have A) Not signed a renewal contract after the initial 12 months and B) if rent is outstanding or owed, am I responsible for being the original housemate or is it the people who lived there and left without paying etc? Surely the land lady should of taken action at the time?

I am just so confused by all of this and worried that I will be left footing the bill for other people. Should I send a letter asking for my money to be paid? Have I got a leg to stand on? I also have a copy of the original contract but no proof of receipt for the deposit although this will be in the company of the letting agent.

Many Thanks in advance and hope this is clear to you.

Much respect

SEÁN

Jeremy

Hello Sean,

What a complicated story!  I'm sorry to say this so bluntly, but reading between the lines, the landlord has found someone who they think is a mug and are now milking you for every last penny.

You're paid rent when you thik it's not due, covered other people's rents and deposits.  You're definately going to heaven for your kindness!

Depending on the total amount you think you can recover from her, go to a solicitor for an evaluatory conversation.  Much will hinge on whether there was one initial agreement covering all tenants or one agreement per tenant.  In fact it's not worth saying much more until you let us know which.

But to answer your specific questions:

If you did not formally renew the tenancy it moved onto a Statutory Periodic Tenancy so the same terms and conditions applied throughout your stay.

If the Landlors did not get your countersigned-copy of the inventory they are on rather dodgy ground to with-hold the rent due to damages.  But they can with-hold the deposit if they can prove non-payment.


mrseany

Thanks Jeremy for your response,

I am certainly worried. I have emailed the letting agent and broke down the situation just so they are clear with what's going on.

As far as I am aware the initial agreement covered all of us as a threesome and not individually. However, one of the original three never even moved in and one moved out after a year.

Shouldn't I have been made aware of a Statutory Periodic Tenancy and if the letting agency had me down as still living in the property even though I had moved out two months before then surley either information was not passed on to them from the land lady.

Also, as far as I was concerned the letting agency ceased to exist after the first year but clearly they must of been involved. I cannot understand why they never once thought to get in contact.

I am currently waiting to hear back from the letting agency. Oh the deposit was placed in a rent deposit scheme. Not sure if this helps?

Can the land lady keep the deposit if she can prove rent was not paid for? Also if she knew there was a discrepancy in the rent halfway throughout us living there and did nothing about it, is she responsible and is she still allowed to take the deposit?

Seány

Jeremy

Hello Seany,

Sorry for my delay in getting back to you.

Thanks for he extra info.  I'm going to repeat some of my original advice.  Go and see a solicitor.  The amount in dispute is £2k-odd and it's worth getting their expert advice.

You may have painted yourself into a corner as far as the tenancy agreement is cocerned.  Your actions give the Landlord (who you think is trying it on) to claim you became the Head Tenant, responsible for all sub-tenant payments and damages.  You've certainly behaved like that, even if that was not the formal agreement.

I agree you've had some very bad customer service like not explaining what a Statutory Tenancy is, but that's a different question to what's legal or not.  And now you're trying to recover money in someone else's posession, I think you need to focus more upon what legal rights and options you have now, rather than what should have happened in the past.

Yes, the landlady can keep deposit money to cover unpaid rent.  But she must be able to prove the loss at an evidence level acceptable by a court, e.g. disclosure of all bank account(s) transactions during the period to show money not paid; accounts authorised by ACCA accontant, that kind of thing.  This is an evidence level considerably higher than some home-brew rent paid spreadsheet.

For reasons I said before I think they've got no hope of retaining any of your money on grounds of damage to the property.

I hope things turn out well for you.