SMF - Just Installed!

Can somebody shed some light on this...?

Started by McW, May 15, 2023, 04:21:07 PM

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Hi, I have registered oin this forum sinply to try and have an answer to whats going on with my situatuion at the moment as I can't find any 'straightforward' advice online anywhere.
Basically, I am currently (but soon to be out) living in a rented flat of which I have been a tenant for six years, a good tenant, never missed my rent, never caused any damage, and only on two or three times had to contact the letting agency regarding things such as the cooker stopped working.  So around five or six weeks ago, I got an email from the letting agent saying that the lalndlord wanted to put the rent up, only fifty quid a month, but still.. it's a rent increase. The letting agent made a 'thing' about the fact that the rent hasn't increased in the six years I've been there, and market rates etc etc... all the usual guff they come out with, to which I said I wasn't happy with a proposed rent increase as the kitchen is falling apart and the place is generally pretty...meh..! I said I would meet half way and pay an extra twenty five pounds a month. It was the presumptuous way the letting agent just said 'simply sign the acceptance form and from July the new rate will apply' that really wound me up as if I was going to be over the moon with it...?  she then said that she would let the landlord know my position. Everything went quiet for about three/four weeks and then I get a phone call from letting agent saying that the landlord is selling the flat....   to me this all sounds very suspicious and very much like revenge (or at the very least 'a bit of a hissy fit'.)  As I am on a monthly rolling contract, I was told  that I have the remainder of the current rent month left, plus two months (as when I moved in it was prior to the new six month thing coming into effect)... this takes me up to mid July. My question is why does she want me out rather than just sell with a tenant in situ...  and also, have I been given a section 21 here...???  I haven't had anything in writing, it's all been just talking between ourselves, cant seem to find an answer anywehere. I've been offered first refusal on the flat but im not going to buy it, Im going to buy a different one. Any advice on excatly whats going on and whether anyone thinks this sounds a bit suspect would be very much appriciated.

Simon Pambin

Quote from: McW on May 15, 2023, 04:21:07 PM
My question is why does she want me out rather than just sell with a tenant in situ...  and also, have I been given a section 21 here...???

Properties with a tenant in situ tend to sell for less than properties with vacant possession, especially where the tenant is paying below the market rate. An empty property appeals to owner occupiers and to landlords who will probably spend a couple of weeks and a couple of grand freshening the place up before they rent it out at a higher rate.

If you haven't had anything in writing then you haven't been given a Section 21. There's a specific format for the notice, and other requirements that the landlord must have met in order for it to be valid.


It's not at all suspect... but things (procedures) may not be being done correctly (yet). Verbally isn't good enough for this kind of situation.

Although not explained to you in any detail, the cost of living is affecting everyone - Tenants, Landlord, Owner-Occupiers - what £s we had before don't go as far. Add to that the fact that many mortgage rates have increased, it could easily be the Landlord's position that letting this flat to you isn't financially viable - or at least financially attractive - unless there was a rent increase. And, after 6 years, while £50 is still a large-ish sum, it doesn't seem unreasonable - I mean, it feels like the maximum it would be would be 10% (probably less, but only you know that %age). The same answer applies to selling with you remaining on - it's not attractive. Sure, there's the loss of rent, but the market is hot and the Landlord possibly calculates it'll go quickly once it's empty. And it'll go for more without you in it. The fact you've been offered first refusal also hints at some kind of reasonable Landlord who isn't just turfing you out for "revenge".

Your line - "I won't buy this, I'll buy another" - would give me the impression it's Tenant, not Landlord, who has a kind of "revenge" on the mind here. Remember - cold, hard numbers. It's both expensive and inconvenient to move - you might have to change GP and all the other associated gubbins. So maybe negotiation skills can be used here if you're ready to buy anyway... a few thousand saved could easily be put to good use where you are.

Remember, though, even the most stupid Landlord or Letting Agent will get the process right in the end... so not worth trying to hang on where you're not wanted. You suggest you will buy, that's fine. However, if you intend to rent again, take a look at the market ASAP and see whether the £50 increase starts to look reasonable in that light. The BBC has stories focusing on the contest Tenants are going through (sometimes even to get a viewing).

For context, I have recently sent out a bunch of rent increase emails... all were accepted, readily... they were about the 3% mark... Tenants truly understand this is happening... I do this annually, so if you've not had a rent increase for 6 years then you've been doing quite well - better than you would have done if I was your Landlord. Meeting half-way is a good tactic, but it might also be a good tactic to roll over until you aren't surprised and can elect to take action in your own time. Good luck.


It's got nothing to do with the cost of living... she's selling the flat to give her son a deposit on a house, and thanks for implying i have 'revenge' on my mind here. The landlord in question happens to work for the local council on the 'helping people with the cost of living' department.... she see's people on a daily basis using food banks, being evicted, freezing because of no heating and so on. I refuse a rent increase....   and all of a sudden she wants to sell the place, hypocirtical in the highest order. I think if I put this onto any other forum on planet earth other than a 'landlord' forum, everybody would feel there was some form of vindictiveness going on here, your reply (and particularly implying that I am revengeful) is typical of a forum such as this I suppose. Thanks though..??


The landlord hasn't served notice, and, until they do, nothing has actually happened.

Taking your other point about vindictiveness, I think you're slightly deluded. If what the agent has said is the case and the rent hasn't increased for six years, an increase in itself doesn't sound unreasonable. Obviously, as the person expected to pay more, you're not going to be happy with it, but it doesn't sound like the landlord is taking the mickey.

If they want to sell the property, or be unhappy with you not wanting to pay the increase, that's up to them. That, again, doesn't sound strange. If they are thinking of selling up to fund a deposit for their son, how is that odd?

There's a mechanism they can use to impose a rent increase that they've not used, which seems quite decent of them (you'd have to appeal to a tribunal to show that the landlord was overcharging for the property or pay the full increase). If you don't like your landlord's attitude, move to somewhere else. Expecting a landlord to behave as you would prefer isn't reasonable, they're people expecting to make money from letting out property - if they tried to put the rent up just because they could, what's wrong with that?
How have you reacted to everyone else putting up their prices?


You seem to think the landlord has to explain her reasons for selling to you. It's her house and as long as she complies with the law (which she has) she can end your tenancy. You have been very lucky indeed to have had the same rent for 6 years.You don't want to pay the higher rent,fine,then look for somewhere with an acceptable rent (good luck with that) By the way,paying your rent on time does not win you a medal. I am eating out tonight and will pay the bill when it comes,it's an arrangement  that seems to work for most people.
Are you perhaps a teeny bit jealous that she is giving her son money for a house,instead of putting you (the best boy) first?

Simon Pambin

If your landlord had routinely put the rent up by about tenner a month every year from year 2, I dare say it would have bothered you a lot less, you'd be paying that fifty quid a month by now and she'd have already had an extra £1,800 off you.

What looks to you like vindictiveness, looks to me like somebody who's not all that keen on being a landlord, deciding to stop being a landlord because it's not worth the hassle to them.


Quote from: McW on May 16, 2023, 06:38:16 AMIt's got nothing to do with the cost of living... Thanks though..??

When the rent increase was proposed it certainly could have formed part of it. The Landlord receiving another £600 each year isn't going to help with a deposit. is it? Your reaction at that time probably forced the Landlord to think again... and now you are where you are. None of this might be "all of a sudden"... the first amicable route to getting more money from you obviously failed, so this was the alternative if you were to respond like you did... so, possibly, not "all of a sudden" at all but part of a cascading plan of alternative courses of action.

Quote from: McW on May 16, 2023, 06:38:16 AMThanks though..??

We always try to be objective. We can only go on what you provide, but you asked for insight, I think, from a different angle - a Landlord's angle, maybe?. Sadly, you'd failed to divulge relevant information re. the deposit. If I had a choice of helping my own spawn onto the housing ladder vs. keeping on a Tenant who looked like they were about to fight modest rent increases every 5 or 6 years, then I know what I'd be doing too.


Quote from: heavykarma on May 16, 2023, 07:52:40 AMBy the way,paying your rent on time does not win you a medal.

I consider that to be the bare minimum, just the same as not causing damage.

Simon Pambin

Quote from: heavykarma on May 16, 2023, 07:52:40 AM
I am eating out tonight and will pay the bill when it comes,

Going anywhere nice?


Red Hot Mama Pizza Warwick,great food and trad.surroundings.

Simon Pambin

Quote from: heavykarma on May 16, 2023, 07:09:25 PM
Red Hot Mama Pizza Warwick,great food and trad.surroundings.

Looks nice. Unfortunately I don't like pizza so I'd have to stick to antipasti and wine all night.

Not that there's anything wrong with that...  :)