UK Landlord Forum / Life

Being a first-time buyer is fun! For example - recently I learned about such a thing as 'Chancel repair liability' and was a little bit shocked.   But it's not a big deal.

The big deal is that I need to move out of the current rented property as the landlord sold the house. The agency(LL) already served me the 21 notice, so I have less than 2 months to move into my new house. And my solicitor said that he needs around 16 weeks to finish the buying process.

What would you do in my place? What options do I have?

I plan to do 2 things :

1) Ask the agency to let me live here till the moment when I'm ready to move into my first house

2) Ask the solicitor if he is able to speed up the process for an extra payment and guarantee that he will finish everything by the time suitable for me.

How about that?

Quote from: goodfella on January 22, 2024, 06:28:45 PMThe big deal is that I need to move out of the current rented property as the landlord sold the house. The agency(LL) already served me the 21 notice, so I have less than 2 months to move into my new house.

That that have sold the house is your landlord's problem, not yours. They were foolish to sell it while you are still their tenant.

You are not obliged to move out by the Section 21 date. Just sit tight and keep paying the rent. The agency & landlord can do nothing to remove you unless they apply for a court order which takes many months.


The alternative approach is that your landlord might offer you money to move out, i.e. payment to get you out when they want the property and for the inconvenience they are causing you. The amount will be a point of negotiation if you choose to do this.

You hold all the power here. Don't let the landlord or agent bully you.

Quote from: HandyMan on January 22, 2024, 07:26:04 PM

Quote from: goodfella on January 22, 2024, 06:28:45 PMThe big deal is that I need to move out of the current rented property as the landlord sold the house. The agency(LL) already served me the 21 notice, so I have less than 2 months to move into my new house.

That that have sold the house is your landlord's problem, not yours. They were foolish to sell it while you are still their tenant.

You are not obliged to move out by the Section 21 date. Just site tight and keep paying the rent. The agency & landlord can do nothing to remove you unless they apply for court which takes many months.


The alternative approach is that your landlord might offer you money to move out, i.e. payment to get you out when they want the property and for the inconvenience they are causing you. The amount will be a point of negotiation if you choose to do this.

You hold all the power here. Don't let the landlord or agent bully you.

Thank you for reassurance. I think some details would be of interest for you.

I've been on a rolling contract with them for several years, 7 to be more precise. This October all of a sudden they sent me a notice about raising my rent on 200 pounds a months from December.  When December came, after I made my first increased payment, they invited me to talk and informed me about selling the house and that they want me out soon next year.

After New Year they asked me to come to the agency to talk. I came. They said that the landlord decided to give me 200 pounds back and I should carry on paying my usual rent till the end. And at this very meeting they handed the 21 Notice to me and made a picture of me taking it from their hands.


It looks weird to me. Why on earth would the want to stop charging me 200 pounds more?   There must be some reasoning. Most likely there is some sort of legislation on their way. I made some research at that time, and, as far as I remember, such move as increasing the rent because the landlord is selling the house would invalidate the Notice 21. Something of the kind.

No. That's not the case.

Everything handyman says is correct. So your answer is 1).

You can't really speed up a house purchase without cutting down on the checks you need to make and you shouldn't do that (and if you're taking out a mortgage you can't).

Apologise to the agent, but it will take them as long a time to process the sale as it will for you to buy, in reality. Agree that when you know your completion date you'll agree a surrender on that day, otherwise you'll end up paying rent after you move out, because you'll need to give notice.

Quote from: jpkeates on January 23, 2024, 07:17:00 AMNo. That's not the case.

Everything handyman says is correct. So your answer is 1).

You can't really speed up a house purchase without cutting down on the checks you need to make and you shouldn't do that (and if you're taking out a mortgage you can't).

Apologise to the agent, but it will take them as long a time to process the sale as it will for you to buy, in reality. Agree that when you know your completion date you'll agree a surrender on that day, otherwise you'll end up paying rent after you move out, because you'll need to give notice.

Oh yes, thank you very much indeed for mentioning that surrender thing. I read about it the other day, and now I now I know what to do with it.

Update.

The letting agency(the letting agency i'm renting my current house from) asked me to send them some correspondence with my solicitor to prove that we are in the process of buying a property. They say they need it to show to the landlord.
I understand that the landlord needs to be sure that we extend our stay for a reason.

I want to send them this email:
 

Dear Name of the Agency,


Following your request to share some correspondence with the solicitor for you to pass it to the landlord, I am sending you a screenshot of some of it.

Please find a scan of the letter to/from the solicitor attached to this message.


When I know the completion date I'll agree a surrender on that day

And it looks like it will be possible in around 2 months' time.

Till this time please rest assured that the rent will be paid  as usual.

Kind regards,

Mr XXXX

Do you think it's a good idea?
Or should I just ignore the agency's request, as such information may enable them to start pestering on my solicitor trying to speed them up?

I'd send the email as planned. Nothing anyone else can do can make you go any faster than you need to.

I can understand the landlord wanting to be sure about what you're doing and I don't see any real downside for you.

Quote from: jpkeates on March 02, 2024, 06:32:53 PMI'd send the email as planned. Nothing anyone else can do can make you go any faster than you need to.

I can understand the landlord wanting to be sure about what you're doing and I don't see any real downside for you.

Thank you, I'll send it to them next week.

Here's the scan of the recent reply from the solicitor about the timescale.

As far as I understand the solicitor will be able to advise me about the time scale only after 5th April. How long do you think, judging from your personal experience, it could take me to move into the new house after the 5th of April?

Unless the searches turn up something odd, it should be fairly early in April. There should be plenty of time to deal with anything arising from the other queries before then.

The solicitor's advice is useless, however. It's 100% safe and correct in the sense that serving notice before exchange has some risks, but, in reality, that would normally mean that you'd end up paying at least another month's rent. If the landlord is happy with a surrender, that doesn't really matter, but it's not particularly helpful otherwise.

Quote from: jpkeates on March 03, 2024, 06:00:23 PMUnless the searches turn up something odd, it should be fairly early in April. There should be plenty of time to deal with anything arising from the other queries before then.

The solicitor's advice is useless, however. It's 100% safe and correct in the sense that serving notice before exchange has some risks, but, in reality, that would normally mean that you'd end up paying at least another month's rent. If the landlord is happy with a surrender, that doesn't really matter, but it's not particularly helpful otherwise.

Thank you for your opinion. I really appreciate it.

Hopefully the searches won't turn up anything odd, and everything will be over in April.

Update

15th March the eviction notice period expired, and I paid my next month rent along with sending them the message discussed above. After a short while they just emailed me back this dry phrase "Thank you for your email."

In two weeks' time I'm gonna need to pay the rent again, and I have such a feeling that shortly after that date the contracts will be exchanged and all the payments will be made.

Now my main concern is, if possible, not to end up paying rent after I move out.

UPDATE

Couple of days ago I received a "mortgage information questionnaire" from the solicitor to to ensure them that my instructions match with the lender's
requirements. They want me to fill it. It is mostly straight forward, but there are some things that I'm not quite sure what to tell them.
I'd appreciate if you guys spare some of your time to comment on the main points.

There are two questions which I would like to clarify:

1) Please provide your quote for buildings insurance and confirm that you will supply the on-risk
policy on exchange of contracts.

If you are arranging your own Buildings Insurance the interest of your Lender should be noted on the
policy. Before completion we will require sight of your Building Insurance Schedule and I would be
grateful if you could please telephone your insurance company and ask them to put in force the
buildings insurance schedule when I inform you of a date upon which exchange of contracts will take
place.

I haven't got any buildings insurance yet. As far as I understand they want me to get it somewhere and give them a sort of reference number. Am I right? How long will it take me? 


2) Will there be any persons over the age of 17 years residing at the property other than you?


And this one is a very weird question. Because I have no clue yet. I mean it is only me and my wife who are buying the property and going to live there. But we do have in mind to take another person to live in one of the rooms sometimes. We really do not know when he may move in. May be at the same day with us. May be never. May be it will be someone else at some point in future for a brief period of time or may be for a long period.

But, well, I'm really at a loss what to answer, because the solicitor specifically mention the following:

Please note that you will be in breach of your mortgage conditions if you do not advise us of any
adult occupiers.

I just don't know what to answer in the questionnaire. If I answer that there won't be any other adult occupiers, but by the time of exchanging contracts or after exchanging contracts the guy will let me know that he would like to rent a room in my house and that he will move in at the same day with us, would it be a breach of my mortgage conditions ? I really do not understand what they want from me.


I am not going to let the property, but I didn't expect that it would not be up to me to decide if I want to occupy the property personally or I want to let it. Look at that text:


Although in many respects the interests of the Buyer and the Lender are the same (in particular they
both want the property to be acquired with a good and marketable title) there are circumstances in
which a conflict of interest may arise because information comes into our hands which you would prefer
us not to tell the lender, such as:
a. The price is lower than you told the lender (because this means that the property is worth less
than the lender thought)
b. You are receiving a Cash Back or other inducement from the Seller (again because this
suggests that the property is worth less than the purchase price)
c. You have decided to let the property rather than occupy it personally
d. Your financial circumstances have changed – for instance you may have lost your job (because
you may not be able to keep up the repayments on a reduced income).
Because we owe you a duty of complete confidence if a conflict of interest arises, we will ask for your
permission to disclose the circumstances to the lender. If you withhold permission, we must cease to
act any further in the transaction either for you or for the lender and return the lender's papers advising
the lender that a conflict of interest has arisen. This signifies that something unusual has occurred and
the lender will probably withdraw the Loan Offer



I never though about having Mortgage Protection. Can I have it at some point in future or according to the text below, in case I don't have it before completing of the purchase, I won't be able to do so later?


If you are having Mortgage Protection to cover your mortgage payments and life premiums in the event
of critical illness and/or redundancy this needs to be put on risk on completion.

2) Renting a room is not letting as meant by their text - your answer is a simple "no".

Lenders don't actually care about much other than the mortgage being paid in the real world.

Quote from: Hippogriff on April 08, 2024, 01:54:06 PM2) Renting a room is not letting as meant by their text - your answer is a simple "no".

Lenders don't actually care about much other than the mortgage being paid in the real world.

2) Will there be any persons over the age of 17 years residing at the property other than you? So you advise to answer NO even if a person will be residing in one of the rooms? Are you sure about that? I really doubt about that. I'm going to ask the broker about it. I believe he has experience with these sorts of things.

Yep, I'm sure about it (even though it's irrelevant, you had suggested here in writing that you, yourself, had no clue about room occupancy - now you state certainty).

Quote from: Hippogriff on April 09, 2024, 07:30:32 AMYep, I'm sure about it (even though it's irrelevant, you had suggested here in writing that you, yourself, had no clue about room occupancy - now you state certainty).

Thank you. Yes, I have no clue about room occupancy, but I do think about talking to a certain person about moving in one of the rooms. I am not sure if he agrees to do this or not. So I need to know where I stand legally before asking anyone about such a thing.

Quote from: goodfella on April 09, 2024, 11:29:15 AMSo I need to know where I stand legally before asking anyone about such a thing.

The lender is asking you the question because they want to ensure that they can easily repossess the property in the event that you fail to keep up your mortgage payments.

If you let the property to a tenant, the the lender would have to evict them first. If another adult (i.e. over 17) lives there as part of your 'family' (whatever the actual relationship), then the lender would need to obtain their confirmation that they will move out before repossession.

If however, you rent a room to a lodger, who shares some of the living space with you, then the lodger has no ongoing right to remain and you can ask them (require them) to leave at any time.

Thus, if the person you plan to move in will have the status of lodger, then you can safely answer No to the lender's question.

Quote from: goodfella on April 09, 2024, 11:29:15 AMSo I need to know where I stand legally before asking anyone about such a thing.

You really don't and you're clearly caught in a trap of overthinking. But go ask your Broker rather than strangers on the Internet (especially so if you think you know better anyway). And I don't mean that flippantly... I'm just pointing out that time and effort is being wasted. Part of this uncertainty is because it's your first time, another part is 'cos you don't seem to know what you're going to be doing anyway, i.e. "think about".

It remains a "no" answer, just in case there's value in reiterating that.

I think you need to understand that a lodger has few of the legal rights that a tenant or a person you are co-habiting with would have. The lenders won' t care about a casual lodger. You are overthinking this, anxiety can do that, but you are worrying yourself without reason.

Quote from: HandyMan on April 09, 2024, 01:31:43 PM

Quote from: goodfella on April 09, 2024, 11:29:15 AMSo I need to know where I stand legally before asking anyone about such a thing.

The lender is asking you the question because they want to ensure that they can easily repossess the property in the event that you fail to keep up your mortgage payments.

If you let the property to a tenant, the the lender would have to evict them first. If another adult (i.e. over 17) lives there as part of your 'family' (whatever the actual relationship), then the lender would need to obtain their confirmation that they will move out before repossession.

If however, you rent a room to a lodger, who shares some of the living space with you, then the lodger has no ongoing right to remain and you can ask them (require them) to leave at any time.

Thus, if the person you plan to move in will have the status of lodger, then you can safely answer No to the lender's question.

Ok,thank u, now I see.

IF this guy moves in some day do I need to make some sort of a contract with him to confirm his status as a lodger?

Wouldn't his status be automatically considered as a lodger if he just starts to live there in one of the rooms?
We have the experience of him living in one of the rooms of the house we rent. We never made any contract with him. He's a decent person, not a trouble maker at all. He never asked any contract from me, and I never needed him to sign anything.

Quote from: Hippogriff on April 10, 2024, 09:10:52 AM

Quote from: goodfella on April 09, 2024, 11:29:15 AMSo I need to know where I stand legally before asking anyone about such a thing.

You really don't and you're clearly caught in a trap of overthinking. But go ask your Broker rather than strangers on the Internet (especially so if you think you know better anyway). And I don't mean that flippantly... I'm just pointing out that time and effort is being wasted. Part of this uncertainty is because it's your first time, another part is 'cos you don't seem to know what you're going to be doing anyway, i.e. "think about".

It remains a "no" answer, just in case there's value in reiterating that.

  I really appreciate your advice and totally agree about the trap of overthinking. But for me it is a very serious matter , that's why I prefer to play as safe as possible.
Now that you clarified it I am confident in answering "NO".

But I still in no rush to send the questionnaire back until I clarify the buildings insurance question.
We called the seller agent and asked him about it, and he said that our solicitor should know what sort of buildings insurance we need. As far as I understand the free holder normally have the buildings insurance and the lease holders cover such expenses with service charge. But we don't have service charge there, it's a virtual freehold, a maisonette with a separate entrance and own garden.
I wanna ask the solicitor why didn't he find out what is the situation with the buildings insurance. Wasn't it actually part of their job to find it out and tell me what exactly do I need to do in regards of buildings insurance instead of just sending me the questionnaire?

Quote from: heavykarma on April 10, 2024, 12:12:43 PMI think you need to understand that a lodger has few of the legal rights that a tenant or a person you are co-habiting with would have. The lenders won' t care about a casual lodger. You are overthinking this, anxiety can do that, but you are worrying yourself without reason.

Thank you for reassuring me. I know that you are right. But in serious cases like purchasing a property I prefer to stick to the principle "better safe than sorry"

If it's virtual, then have you considered virtual insurance?

Quote from: Hippogriff on April 11, 2024, 03:54:11 PMIf it's virtual, then have you considered virtual insurance?

Well, virtual freehold is not a legal term, as far as I know. Thus a virtual insurance is not exactly what I need to consider, isn't it? 

Virtual freehold isn't a legal term. But it does mean something.

You are mistaken about the role of a conveyancer. It's essentially a box ticking process, they won't think of anything unusual or out of their normal work process.

Quote from: jpkeates on April 12, 2024, 09:51:36 AMVirtual freehold isn't a legal term. But it does mean something.

You are mistaken about the role of a conveyancer. It's essentially a box ticking process, they won't think of anything unusual or out of their normal work process.

Now I understand that.

What do you think of mortgage life insurance? Do you have one?

My broker advised me to take it. I still need to think it over. Is it possible to have it after buying the house?

Quote from: goodfella on April 26, 2024, 03:24:42 PMWhat do you think of mortgage life insurance? Do you have one?

My broker advised me to take it.

It's irrelevant whether anyone else here has mortgage life insurance.

Whether you need it depends entirely on your circumstances:
- Do you have a partner?
- Do you have children?
- Do you want someone to inherit the full value of your property if you die?
- etc

If these are not relevant to you, then mortgage life insurance may be of no benefit.


Do you have a Will? If so, consider what it says (which should reflect your wishes).

If you don't have a Will, then now is a good time to think about what should happen if you die, and get one drawn up.

Quote from: HandyMan on April 26, 2024, 07:02:37 PM

Quote from: goodfella on April 26, 2024, 03:24:42 PMWhat do you think of mortgage life insurance? Do you have one?

My broker advised me to take it.

It's irrelevant whether anyone else here has mortgage life insurance.

Whether you need it depends entirely on your circumstances:
- Do you have a partner?
- Do you have children?
- Do you want someone to inherit the full value of your property if you die?
- etc

If these are not relevant to you, then mortgage life insurance may be of no benefit.


Do you have a Will? If so, consider what it says (which should reflect your wishes).

If you don't have a Will, then now is a good time to think about what should happen if you die, and get one drawn up.

It's me and my wife(unmarried partner). We take mortgage together. Neither of us has a Will.

As for me, yes, I think it may be of benefit for both of us.
Now the question is WHEN can do it. I mean, is it ok to think about it and have this insurance in around a couple of months'(years) time? Or it must be done before the exchange/completion?

Quote from: goodfella on April 28, 2024, 04:59:20 PMNow the question is WHEN can do it. I mean, is it ok to think about it and have this insurance in around a couple of months'(years) time?

Again, it is your and your partner's circumstances that should be considered.

What would happen to your partner if you got knocked down and killed by a car* on the day after exchange/completion and you did not have this insurance?

Would she be able to cover the mortgage repayments in full and be able to afford to live?

Likewise for you if she was killed?

* Other life limiting perils exist


And please make an appointment to get Wills drawn up now. Just do it. Tomorrow could be too late. It probably won't be, but it certainly could be.

Being unmarried in a relationship where there is anything jointly owned with value makes having wills essential.

No messing about, one of you dying without wills in place is even more of a disaster than one of you dying.