UK Landlord Forum / Life

Hi,
This is my first post so go easy on me  .  I have tried to search the answer to this before bugging the helpful people here but I couldn't easily find the answer.

I have been letting out a property for years and (cardinal sin) just had it ticking along as my uncle is the tenant. 
The Renters Rights Bill started being mentioned and I need to make sure I have everything to hand in case I need to get the property back. It's a far more serious matter now!

I know documentation is key when trying to get your property back.

Are these all the documents required (I think I need to get them signed and dated):-

* Tenancy Agreement(s)
* Current EPC
* Gas Certificates
* EICR
* Right to rent document
* Legionella test results?

At the minute I have:-

1. A lapsed tenancy agreement which has now gone periodic.  Should I get a new one in place?
2. Current EPC from 2019.  This will need to be C or above but not sure by when.
3. Gas Certs.  I don't have one for 2023 or 2024.  The 2024 was missed completely by me but 2023 was done however; my gas engineer nor I can't find a copy.  I have 2025.
4. EICR - I have this with another 2 years to run on it
5. How to Rent Guide - these change all the time, is there a way to get notified of changes?
6. Is the Legionella test a requirement as I've read conflicting information?

Sorry for all the questions but I'm trying to understand how to protect myself, family and investment.

Thank you in advance to anyone who can shed even some light on all of this.  It's a minefield!

There's a helpful section 21 flowchart sticky thread on this forum which is a link to the best possible checklist for your s21 needs.

You don't need to get anything signed and dated but its a help.

Answers:
1- It won't make any difference.
2- As long as that was current when the tenancy began that's fine (no need for C yet).
3- Some people will tell you that the missing certificate is an issue. Stick to the one current when the tenancy began and the one current when the notice is/was served. Explain the others are missing if pushed on it.
4- That (oddly) doesn't matter for s21 purposes.
5- No. All of the changes are listed on the government website where you can get a copy. You need one from the start of the tenancy and any new tenancies, including the periodic one if it's statutory, if the document has changed. Some of the specialists serve all possible copies for the hell of it.
6- No, it never was (other than part of the obligation for your property to be safe).

If it's your uncle, I'm not sure why you're contemplating making a possession claim, that's a fairly hostile thing to do.

Thank you very much for the information.  I will check the flow chart sticky.

I have rented to my uncle since 2006/2007 so do not have the initial tenancy agreement which may be an issue.

It's not hostile it's preparation.
My uncle is on benefits, doesn't keep the property well and I have let it to him for £100 p/m less than market value for those 20 years.  He always pays on time and was doing the odd things himself in the property such as replacing broken cabinet doors etc.  It's been a good win/win relationship and hopefully will continue to be.  That said, with the legislation initially seeming to say you could never get your property back (abolishing section 21 completely), interest rate increases, tax changes over the years etc, etc.  This has made me extremely nervous that I could lose control of my property should my uncle not be able to pay (such as benefits being cut), the relationship turns sour etc, etc.  I need to make sure I am compliant NOW so that I don't hit issues in the future.  I understand how it may have read.

That does make sense. First of all, the abolition of s21 means that much of what you're looking at will be redundant by the end of the year. Currently most of the must do elements of a s21 notice aren't being carried forward into the new possession claims process. So, it might be worth waiting to see what the new rules require rather than possibly causing some tension by serving pointless documents that unnerve the tenant.

Losing section 21 isn't the end of the world, it's being completely blown out of proportion.  Ignoring a family relationship (which is a positive in itself) a tenant who's paid rent for 20 years is pretty much the gold standard. I don't know what £100 represents against the market rent, but most of my long term tenants were paying less than the market rate I'd have got for a new tenancy.

Quote from: spudfingers on April 01, 2025, 04:44:03 PMIt's not hostile it's preparation.

As you didn't prepare (maybe not the correct word) well-enough to this point the act of bringing things into line could have unintended consequences... like your uncle starting to piece two and two together... it's hard to have this (assumed almost silent) relationship for such a long time and then rush around gathering things together, it's all very noticeable but not very explainable with "I'm just being prepared".

As no-one knows, for sure, what the new regime will be exactly like, in this case I'd suggest a more reactive approach - just let sleeping dogs lie and deal with the fallout if it comes to pass. It doesn't sound like you want to 'swap-out' your Tenant for the same of achieving a market rate, correct me if I'm wrong, so isn't it best to avoid rocking the boat?

Ignorance is genuinely bliss. No excuse for it, but still bliss.

The notes for the Section 21 tell you 90% of what you NEED

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/65045a2b6771b9000dfdab61/Notes_to_form_6A.pdf

You did not mention Energy Performance Certificate in your bullet list, although you do seem aware of it, this lasts 10 years but check on .GOV to make sure it was done properly.

https://www.gov.uk/find-energy-certificate

Gas Certificates can be a risk, especially when you don't have good reason, there are contrary case law decisions so sometimes it can be the Judge, the form that carries on the Form6a (S21) asks you to list all previous ones, but you might get away with the original when they moved in and the latest.  Two failed years might be tolerated for Covid but it puts you in a very bad light as far as the Judge is concerned.  So if you got them done but lost the paperwork go back to the firms and get them.  There is no .Gov warning but you can check this page for copies of them all, they add new ones when they come out.

How to rent is important, sometimes critically, the professional eviction firms give the original, the latest, the easy read as one document then include a library of the rest. 

https://nearlylegal.co.uk/how-to-rent-archive/

It being your Uncle you would hope all this would be amicable but when they trot off to the Council to inform them that they are being evicted, that can be where the trouble starts.  The Council have an obligation to try to prevent homelessness, so they will advise the Tenant on things they should do and the Council may call you to ask if you would consider keeping them longer.  If they owe your Uncle a housing duty then all kinds of games can be played to delay an eviction.

You have not referred to deposit protection, you say you rented around 2006/7 which is when the deposit protection scheme came into force.  You also say that the Tenancy became SPT, so if your first tenancy started after April 7th 2006 then the SPT would have created the obligation to protect the deposit in an approved Gov scheme.  It is not just protecting the deposit, the Prescribed information is important and it is important that this is signed by the Landlord.

The professional eviction companies just return the deposit which removes the risk your failure stopping a S21 but does not stop any legal sanctions being applied, hopefully Uncle would be nice but no guarantee, I have know families fall out over this on numerous occasions.

You might want to consider using this time to increase the rent to market level and offer to bring the property up to date, the Council may even pay deposit and rent for a month. 

Renting to family is not ideal but if it has taken this long without issue why not just regularise matters like market rent, your Uncle can refer a rent increase to First Tier Tribunal if they think it is above market rent for the state of the property.  However, something tells me they won't.

Quote from: spudfingers on April 01, 2025, 04:14:32 PMHi,
This is my first post so go easy on me  .  I have tried to search the answer to this before bugging the helpful people here but I couldn't easily find the answer.

I have been letting out a property for years and (cardinal sin) just had it ticking along as my uncle is the tenant. 
The Renters Rights Bill started being mentioned and I need to make sure I have everything to hand in case I need to get the property back. It's a far more serious matter now!

I know documentation is key when trying to get your property back.

Are these all the documents required (I think I need to get them signed and dated):-

* Tenancy Agreement(s)
* Current EPC
* Gas Certificates
* EICR
* Right to rent document
* Legionella test results?

At the minute I have:-

1. A lapsed tenancy agreement which has now gone periodic.  Should I get a new one in place?
2. Current EPC from 2019.  This will need to be C or above but not sure by when.
3. Gas Certs.  I don't have one for 2023 or 2024.  The 2024 was missed completely by me but 2023 was done however; my gas engineer nor I can't find a copy.  I have 2025.
4. EICR - I have this with another 2 years to run on it
5. How to Rent Guide - these change all the time, is there a way to get notified of changes?
6. Is the Legionella test a requirement as I've read conflicting information?

Sorry for all the questions but I'm trying to understand how to protect myself, family and investment.

Thank you in advance to anyone who can shed even some light on all of this.  It's a minefield!