UK Landlord Forum / Life

I have a property in which there was a leak causing the floor to collapse.  It was a small steady leak which the tenants didn't report as (so they they say) they had assumed was just general water in the bathroom.  Consequently, rather than simply having to repair the leak and dry the area as it appeared, it built up until the floor collapsed into the property below.  Thankfully insurance has covered the majority of the repairs save for the policy excess. 

Rather than expecting the tenants to go without a bathroom for a week whilst we got a contractor in, we  decided to work around the clock to do the bulk of work over a weekend specified by the tenants (they ended up going away for that weekend).  Due to a number of additional repair issues we hadn't planned for, some of the works are still outstanding and due to be finished in the next few days.  These are tiling, replacing the floor covering, and painting (to deal with mould from condensation caused by the tenants not ventilating the bathroom properly).  The bathroom was completed enough for the tenants to have full use of the sink, toilet, bath, and shower (although we weren't able to attach to the wall until tiling has been finished). 

- At no point have the tenants not had access to the bathroom facilities when they needed them.
- The disruption to the tenants has been minimal as we have worked around their schedule to ensure that works take place whilst they are either away or at work. 
- The only works remaining are cosmetic rather than functional and we have promised to have them completed within the next few days. 

Despite all of this, the tenants are not happy and stated that it was a major inconvenience that the works are incomplete.  In my view, I don't see how it's a huge inconvenience as they have full use of the bathroom and the remaining works are only cosmetic.  I have put in writing the reasons why the work is not yet complete - I am awaiting a reply.  However, I get the feeling they are working up to asking for a discount on the rent so thought I would find out where we all stand. 

My questions are:
- Do I owe them a rent abatement?
- If so, how do I go about calculating it?  (ie. is it the whole rent for each day the bathroom was out of action even though they were away or is it per square metre of the area of the property affected) 
- Can I offset this against the mould created by condensation?  (Which I was going to deal with without cost to the tenants to make up for the inconvenience of repair works taking place)
- Do I also have a point to make regarding the fact that their failure to report the issue as soon as it happened meant that the extent of the repairs was greater than it would have been otherwise?

I'd rather keep things amicable if possible as life is a lot easier that way and to date they have been pretty good tenants.  However, I also can't afford to simply give money away, particularly when I'm already covering costs that weren't covered by the insurance and have bust a gut to get the work done as quickly as possible. 

Any help/advice would be much appreciated. 

They need to get real.  Some T's think they are renting a hotel off people instead of renting THEIR HOUSE. 

If they owned a house they would realise that jobs don't get done over night, things that break are their own responsibility and that occasionally things happen that will be an inconvenience such as heating/electrics not working, appliances breaking etc.  I'm sure they all live in some sort of unrealistic bubble.

I wouldn't bother tooing and frowing about offsetting mould etc.  Just wait for them to put their unreasonable demands to you first.  Try not to preempt them as you are not on the same unreasonable level as they are.

If they come to you explain, as you say, if I was told it was leaking in the first place I could have nipped it in the bud, I have rectified it as quickly as I could at expense.  I am not giving a rent rebate.

When is their AST up?

Agreed, jog on smelly tenants.

You have acted more than reasonably, they are due nada.

Thanks for the replies, that was my gut instinct but I just like to be absolutely certain I'm doing everything by the book.  We have bent over backwards to get the work done for them and it really couldn't be helped that it ran over as there was no way for us to know about the additional problems until the old bathroom had been ripped out.  I know it's inconvenient but at the moment I'm living with no boiler, and a half-finished kitchen with no tiles or flooring as all my spare time and money is going in to the rental property.  It does feel like a massive kick in the teeth that I'm living with these issues whilst busting a gut to get things done for the tenants and they complain about the inconvenience of some of the tiling not being finished. 

The fixed period is up so I can give them notice at any time.  However, they have told me they will be moving out in a few months anyway and I want to sell so I don't see any point in giving notice. 

What do you mean you are struggling with jobs in your own home?  You're a Landlord, ergo you got pots of limitless cash!

Let us know if they come back to you for a rent reduction.

Thanks Riptide.  I had a really snotty email from them this evening making some rather petty demands.  I really am quite annoyed with them to be honest.  They have full use of the bathroom and the only remaining work is cosmetic and I've really gone above and beyond what most landlords would do (from buying them new furniture on request through to not having it out with them that the situation is partly their fault for not reporting the leak to me when they first noticed it).   It strikes me that two things are happening here.  Firstly, they have a completely unrealistic idea of what renting actually is - the fact they refer to it as a 'service' says it all really.  I've probably not helped myself by so far having always gone the extra mile to make sure they're happy (such as buying new furniture when they asked for it even though there was nothing wrong with the old stuff).  Secondly, I think they're probably trying it on as the works have run over schedule a little (although it seems even longer because we've had to work around them and also had to stop work to deal with a burst pipe and broken boiler in my own home). 

The main points they made were:

• They believe they're paying for a service and that said service is not up to scratch 
• They seem to think they've done me a favour 'allowing' me to do the work myself rather than pay a contractor as they would have preferred me to.
• That the fact I've worked around their schedule and ensured that they have full use of the bathroom rather than taking it out of action whilst we do the work is a bad thing because it's left them unable to 'legally challenge' me for a rent refund.  (Clearly they've sought legal advice on this then and realised that I am holding up my end of the contract in my actions) This is rather bizarre because they have already told me this would be less preferable to them as they'd have nowhere to stay and a hotel would cost far more than a daily rate of refund they'd get.
• That they're not happy with the level of cleaning we've been doing each day because some dust is left to settle after we leave. Apparently this has incurred them additional cleaning costs (which bar the odd few pennies on additional vacuuming I'm not sure what they mean).  Even so, they'd have the same issue if it was their own house.
• They've told me that we're not allowed to leave any parts, tiles, or tools in the bathroom (it's a very large bathroom and the items are all tucked away tidily) and that we are to carry them up and down several flights of stairs each time we visit. 

I've responded to say I understand it's an inconvenience and that it is frustrating that it has gone over schedule but that we couldn't have known the additional issues were going to crop up and that the delay has been exacerbated by us having to work around their schedule rather than having unrestricted access to the property.

I made it very clear to them (in no uncertain terms) that they're not buying a service but renting a private dwelling and pointed out the difference between renting a private dwelling and a serviced apartment/hotel. I also told them that's my decision and mine only as to whether I use a contractor or do the work myself.   

I've also listed all the issues they've caused that I've bitten my tongue about (such as mould from them not opening windows etc) and given them two options.  I told them they were welcome to move out so we could have unrestricted access for a few days to get the work done completely (and I would refund the rent for those days) or they accept that I've done them a favour working around their schedule, bending over backwards to ensure they didn't have to go without a bathroom and realise there is going to be a little bit of dust and some tools/tiles etc in the bathroom for the next few days.  I've also said that if they're not happy with that, they're welcome to give notice and I'll complete the work after they move out. 

I know that they've had an offer accepted on a house and are waiting to find out when they can move in and that this is probably going to happen beyond two months.  I don't want to be so harsh as to give them notice and leave them without a place to live between the tenancy ending and their completion date but equally I don't want to be taken for a mug.  I also can't leave it ongoing for too long as I'm intending to sell the property (they know this). 

I closed the email by saying that it would be much better if we could proceed amicably as we have done prior to now but that it's down to them if we do.  I guess I'll just have to wait and see what they say.

What would you do given the situation? 

Just unreasonable, not allowing the tools or materials to complete the job left at the job just shows what a lack of grasp on reality they have, coupled with the extra cleaning costs and that they've openly admitted to you that they have sought legal advice re compensation would only point to one thing in my eyes, time to get rid.  Personally I couldn't be dealing with it and although I admire your concern and sympathy that giving them notice won't tie in with their plans, you trying to fit in with them so far has done you no favors.

I suggest you withdraw your 'service' and let them find a better one!

Agreed, cheeky buggers.

Lady, you need to learn the "No" word......... You sound lovely though....

Ha ha thanks I think I do.  I had a reply this morning saying they were 'merely communicating frustrations'.  I responded to say that people don't take legal advice if they're 'merely communicating' and therefore they left me with no choice but to explain to them where we stand legally as well as expressing my own frustrations.  I've made it clear that my not billing them for condensation damage and the insurance excess I've had to pay because they didn't report the leak should be more than enough to make up for them having to hoover a few more times. 

I do generally like to treat people in the way I'd like to be treated but it would seem that when you're a landlord, doing so generally means that people end up taking the p*ss.  I get genuinely sick to death of all these 'greedy landlord' stories.  I should invite the idiots who put them out there to have a look at the repairs that need doing on my own home and then have a look at the lengths I go to in order to be a good landlord.  Can't wait to sell, anyone who chooses to be a landlord is a lot braver (or perhaps dafter!) than I am. 

Thanks again for your help. Here's hoping I won't be back with more problems (although something in my water tells me this may well not be the end of matters)!