UK Landlord Forum / Life

Hi Folks, got quite a long description of events and wondering if anybody can offer any advice.

The short story:

Basically, my mother-in-law (To be known as MIL here on out) was in some financial trouble and put her house on the market, a woman offered to buy but then couldn't so suggested renting instead. My MIL agreed and they got quite friendly while sorting things out. Despite trying to offer advice, she let the new tenant do most of the things including drawing up the inventory and sorting out the tenancy agreement (a standard 6 month AST agreement from the internet).

They agreed a few things via conversation that were not on the agreement, firstly that my MIL kept the garage locked with her possessions in it until she got 'sorted' elsewhere. Also that the new tenant has a dog (despite the agreement stating no pets).

A couple of months in to the rental, my MIL got quite a formal letter from the tenant (which was unusual as they had been communicating via text message informally for months), stating that she had not received confirmation of her deposit being put in a scheme (MIL did not know she had to do this within 30 days) and that she would be "taking possession of the garage".

MIL immediately placed deposit in a scheme and provided the certificate and the argument over the garage went back and forth for a while (The garage is not mentioned at all on the tenancy agreement). MIL had enough so issued tenant with notice to leave at the end of the fixed term (This was about 2.5 months into the 6 months).

In the middle of this, MIL had lost her copy of agreement and asked tenant to provide a copy for her, after some wrangling tenant did this but had doctored the copy (Writing in an exception for her dog, even though MIL did not have an issue with this anyway). We noticed this when MIL actually found her original copy of the agreement.

Tenant made is clear on a number of occasions (verbally) that she had no intention of leaving and wanted to remain in the property in the summer. MIL took a bit of advice and realised her notice was probably not valid due to deposit issue.

Tenancy due to end on December 28th, MIL tried to issue notice again but tenant stated at this point she was taking MIL to court and would not leave until this was resolved.

MIL did little in the meantime as was worried about court. she then payed back deposit in full and issued notice again which was done on 25th of January so tenant must leave by 27th of March. (As tenancy is now periodic)

Court papers come through 28th of January: Tenant suing for 3x deposit value (£2700) and 6 months rental without the garage at £100 reduction per month, so £600. Also that MIL failed to provide Gas and Electricity Safety Certificates. (MIL DID provide Gas safety, and stated that she has been told electricity is not required - Gas safety certificate seems to have gone missing, but the guy who did the test has provided a duplicate, so not worried about that bit).

Up until this month MIL has been living in my lounge, but my letting agents started to get antsy about it so she is now living in a bedsit (which is absolutely disgusting, I wouldn't home my dog there).

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. With any of it... I can provide further details if necessary, just ask

Thanks

Wow, that's some story!  Sorry to hear this woman is causing so much grief, it may well not be the first time she has pulled this stunt...

Unfortunately some of the things this woman is taking your MIL to task over are valid.  Where have the court papers come from, a solicitors?  Your MIL definitely needs to take some legal advice.  Don't concede to this woman though.

The 3 x rent for not securing a deposit is a maximum that a court can penalise the landlord.  Given your story (if you can convince a court) and that the deposit was given back, it can be less.  How was the deposit paid to your MIL?  If it's not traceable and no receipt was given to this woman, I would simply say that no deposit was taken (then you aren't liable for 3 x rent penalty).  You've got evidence this woman is a liar with the doctored tenancy agreement.

Was the garage mentioned in the AST (as being for her use)?  If not, you can tell the woman to go &*£$ herself.  Oh, and you can tell her that she shouldn't have had any pets in he property without your permission.  Your MIL is allergic to dogs and it's going to cost 3 x rent to deep clean the place! 

It's true that no electrical certification is needed.  I assume the court papers are real and not another fraudulent document? A solicitor / court would never have mentioned anything about electrical certs.

Good luck dealing with this woman, do let us know how things pan out.



   

Don't lie or say anything that isn't true.
That simply weakens your case.

You are (hopefully) now following the right steps to end the tenancy.
The tenant can go to court to stop this happening, and can (probably) use the deposit issue as a reason to try and invalidate the notice.

Any court is likely to be reasonably sympathetic to the tenant, but not hostile to your MIL.

However, she has broken several laws - not lodging the deposit, the gas safety certificate has to be given to the tenant with 28 days (not just carried out).
The garage is almost certainly part of the property, so if it's not excluded in the rental agreement it's probably part of what the tenant was renting (whether this was excluded in a verbal agreement or not is going to come down to who the court believes).
So your MIL wasn't allowing "quiet enjoyment" of the property.

Not sure why your MIL paid back the deposit either.

The three times deposit and the amount being claimed are a maximum, and the court has considerable discretion.
I'd get some legal advice and stop just "doing" things.

Quote from: jpkeates on February 16, 2014, 09:37:12 AM
Not sure why your MIL paid back the deposit either.

It seems odd to me that anyone could be allowed to rely on the terms of the deposit protection scheme when the deposit has been returned in full.

I could understand if there was a fine involved but, for there to be compensation, natural justice suggests that there should be an actual harm or loss caused to the claimant. Maybe the law is an ass!

Quote from: jpkeates on February 16, 2014, 09:37:12 AM
Don't lie or say anything that isn't true.
That simply weakens your case.

You are (hopefully) now following the right steps to end the tenancy.
The tenant can go to court to stop this happening, and can (probably) use the deposit issue as a reason to try and invalidate the notice.

Any court is likely to be reasonably sympathetic to the tenant, but not hostile to your MIL.

However, she has broken several laws - not lodging the deposit, the gas safety certificate has to be given to the tenant with 28 days (not just carried out).
The garage is almost certainly part of the property, so if it's not excluded in the rental agreement it's probably part of what the tenant was renting (whether this was excluded in a verbal agreement or not is going to come down to who the court believes).
So your MIL wasn't allowing "quiet enjoyment" of the property.

Not sure why your MIL paid back the deposit either.

The three times deposit and the amount being claimed are a maximum, and the court has considerable discretion.
I'd get some legal advice and stop just "doing" things.

The safety certificate was issued to the tenant, that's not a problem. If she had any concerns she could have just mentioned it however instead the first she has mentioned of the GSC was on the court claim form.

We have a number of witnesses to the verbal agreement regarding the garage and MIL is hoping to get away with it. I think offering some sort of compromise on this would be a wiser course of action but she won't be told.

Refunding the deposit was done after MIL went for some free advice and they told her that was the only way she could issue a valid section 21 notice.

However, issuing a valid section 21 is becoming more and more complicated because all the dates on the original agreement are messed up so it's hard to work out how to get around it all.