UK Landlord Forum / Life

Quote from: heavykarma on March 26, 2018, 03:12:04 PM...and my moral compass sometimes wavers when faced with scumbags.You are correct though,two wrongs don't make a right,and this lady needs to be squeaky clean.

While I admit that it does feel as though the ex-Tenant here is neither in need of this money nor is doing it to prove a point, more to twist the knife, we do only have one side of the story of course and we cannot forget that the situation would never have arisen if things had been done correctly by this Landlord - if things are done right then it's an impossibility for situations like this to arise. This country has too many Landlords - this is coming from a Landlord - who have dipped their toes in, don't really like it, think it's an easy life (it is, to be honest) and don't go about things professionally. When commencing down this path all it would take is half an hour Googling about your obligations and you'd probably not do anything wrong. So, here, all we have is one side of the story and all we can say is that the ex-Tenant is due something, that's according to the law. The ex-Tenant is due something, even though they've suffered no material loss themselves, because if the penalties went to HMRC or some kind of good cause (Shelter?) then no-one would ever bring cases; it would be pointless legislation. The win has to be for their own pocket. And, yes, the loss has to be from the Landlord's pocket. I am doubtful there's an insurance product you can buy that protects you from your own lack of attention to detail... Landlord's Non-Protected Tenancy Deposit Insurance - you can buy it at any time, even just after you receive the Court paperwork, it's only a small premium - and we guarantee to pay out to cover your sure-thing penalty!

I'll buy 2 and stop protecting deposits.

No... it doesn't exist (I checked).

Result!
As some of the experienced landlord expected, he happily accepted the offer and jump out for this opportunity, within 30 mins of my offer given. His solicitor replied as below, can some one tell me if this is normal practice?  I am now thinking this solicitor is his so called solicitor friend who checked his contract when he moved in. Can I ask SRA to investigate his solicitor's practice through out the claim process?


Your offer is accepted.

Please ensure payment is made to my client within the next 14 days.

Can you please give me a call to confirm his account details over the telephone?

I am not allowed to provide these in an email as an anti-fraud measure.

BTW, if I do not charge the tenant for deposit, what do I need to do? Am I still being restricted to DPS?

I admit to feeling somewhat remorseful that you consider this a result - but I can certainly see how it might feel that way, as you now have closure. And the cost is high - and unnecessary - but in the grand scheme of all things, it will be _small... and you'll never end up in this situation again, having learned your lesson well.

Although the email is good - factual and to the point - I would probably like you to see a written (signed and dated by both the ex-Tenant and his little helper - paid or not) document posted through to you, that you could review before sending payment via BACS, after having the telephone conversation to confirm bank account details. This can all easily be done within the 14 days you've been given... and they should not balk at writing a document that gets them what they want.

I see no point in engaging other parties to do anything at all. You have - hopefully - settled.

Dear X,

Thank you for your quick confirmation that the offer of £2,000 is accepted in full and final settlement of any issues arising from this tenancy; thereby ending my liability. In the meantime, could you please create a short document, clearly stating that I am released from all liability in return for this sum and have it signed and dated by both of you. You can post this to my address of Y or email me a scanned PDF. Upon receipt of that document I will do a Faster Payments online transfer and the monies should be with the Tenant more or less immediately.

Regards, Z

Quote from: happy blossom on March 26, 2018, 10:41:57 PMBTW, if I do not charge the tenant for deposit, what do I need to do? Am I still being restricted to DPS?

What do you mean?

Have you been charging Tenants for protecting their deposit? You really shouldn't. The cost of protecting deposits is part of a Landlord's business costs, and is nominal.

Hi Hippogriff,
Thanks for the letter and that is exactly what I need now. I am going to send that email tonight.
For deposit, I mean if I do not need any deposit from the tenant I could trust, is it mean I do not need to deal with DPS and can ignore that legislation?

Sorry for being a stupid landlord, but I have more questions. We obviously already taken corrective actions to prevent this type of tenants entering our property. We have amended our contract by including a additional bill included agreement, and one thing I want to check. If we will add in contact, 'during notice period, tenant shall not unreasonably against room viewing with 24 hours notice, otherwise he will be liable for the rent lose due to this.' Would this help us to claim our rent back? Or by law, it is not possible no matter what we put in contract?

One thing I realized during this claim, is that a breaching in contact cannot help us in anyway, everyone kept saying whatever he breached would not make any harm for him.  SO what is the consequences of a tenant breaching contract? Do we need to define it ourselves in contact? What type of punishment tenant would get? I feel landlords are very vulnerable, the only thing we have is the contact and it can hardly protect us....

In addition, can I ask do you think asking for ref letter from previous landlord would be good idea? How do I know if someone just drafted a letter themselves or given me a fake landlord number to speak to?

Quote from: happy blossom on March 27, 2018, 09:32:46 PMFor deposit, I mean if I do not need any deposit from the tenant I could trust, is it mean I do not need to deal with DPS and can ignore that legislation?

Think about what it is that you're asking - you're asking if you don't take a deposit, do you still need to protect that (non-existent) deposit?

No.

Although not taking a deposit increases risk to you; and the deposit compliance efforts are actually so small in comparison. And how do you ever know you have a Tenant you can trust? There's a very obvious truth - you do not.

Quote from: happy blossom on March 27, 2018, 09:52:19 PM
Sorry for being a stupid landlord, but I have more questions. We obviously already taken corrective actions to prevent this type of tenants entering our property. We have amended our contract by including a additional bill included agreement, and one thing I want to check. If we will add in contact, 'during notice period, tenant shall not unreasonably against room viewing with 24 hours notice, otherwise he will be liable for the rent lose due to this.' Would this help us to claim our rent back? Or by law, it is not possible no matter what we put in contract?

One thing I realized during this claim, is that a breaching in contact cannot help us in anyway, everyone kept saying whatever he breached would not make any harm for him.  SO what is the consequences of a tenant breaching contract? Do we need to define it ourselves in contact? What type of punishment tenant would get? I feel landlords are very vulnerable, the only thing we have is the contact and it can hardly protect us....

In addition, can I ask do you think asking for ref letter from previous landlord would be good idea? How do I know if someone just drafted a letter themselves or given me a fake landlord number to speak to?

Referencing.

Referencing.

Referencing.

Not your own referencing. Formal, paid-for, referencing, done by a Tenant referencing company. Reduce the risk to yourself by engaging in proper referencing. It does not protect you against every outcome, but it gives you a solid feeling people have nothing to hide. Yes to previous Landlord (and even the one before that - for very obvious reasons, right?) but not done by yourself (as you point out, you can be deceived).

AST agreements set the scene for expected behaviour between both parties - there are obligations on both sides. In actual fact the consequences for one party not adhering to the agreement generally results in the tenancy ending and both parties moving on (probably somewhat dissatisfied)... you can follow through on the agreement if you really want... but most Landlords (and Tenants) are just glad to see the other party gone when things start to go wrong. This is called being pragmatic and having a thick-skin... which is what Landlords need.

Being a Landlord is not about bricks, stone, cement, mortar, concrete, wood... it is about people. It is a people business. Most people in the world are reasonable and trustworthy. Some are not. The rental market is somewhat odd because all that exists is a business relationship - supplier and customer - but unlike other relationships where there is a someone buying something from someone and everything works out well (probably because the transaction is usually more immediate) this kind of relationship can often lead to disharmony, especially over time - for some reason people start to resent paying for a roof over their head and start to resent Landlords, even if that feeling wasn't there at the beginning. There's probably a reason why most tenancies last for only 18 months (on average).

So...

Be a happy blossom... be a happy apple blossom if you can. You don't let people walk all over you, but being a good Landlord is often its own reward. Charge a fair rent for a good property that you'd be happy to live in yourself. Treat your Tenants as customers... because that's what they are - they pay you for a product you are selling to them. Never be tempted to treat them as second-class citizens or inconveniences (although I freely admit that some people can wear you down). Do everything professionally and you cannot be opened-up to claims of £2,000. Landlords have a bad reputation - it's our collective responsibility to fix that... probably by being more professional. Don't take shortcuts.

Happy Blossom-I am so pleased for you,and I hope you will soon be able to put this episode behind you.But do learn from it.On the whole,tenants do seem to have the upper hand now in law.When it really comes down to it,few landlords have the time or money to take legal action,whereas tenants can often get free advice and legal aid.

The only thing you can do is take every possible precaution to check out your tenants.It is a false economy to do this yourself.References provided by the tenant alone are worthless.You really need to use an agent.
Don't get so hung up on this matter of viewings being allowed.It is far better to have a brief void period than get a bad tenant.If your property is decent,and the rent reasonable,you could find someone to stay longterm.My current tenants have resided 12 years,6 yrs,4 yrs,3 years,and 5 months.I won't even bother asking the latter to allow viewings,it would put people right off,and I will have to lose some rent while I get it sorted out.  Of course,a lot depends on location.If you are in big city, tenant turnover could be quicker. 

There is no point in putting anything in a contract that cannot be proved.How could you estimate if a viewing would have ended in a definite new tenancy? Good luck!

Thank very much everyone! Unfortunately we are in a student town, with a lot of tenant change overs, and we do not at the moment using any agent for our renting business, plus we are renting rooms out individually.... A lot of work to do.
Can I ask about the reference, how it is work? Does the tenant need to spend money for that? how much would that be? I am afraid if the tenants can afford paying and would we end up losing people due to asking for this?

Can I ask what other docs do you check to decide if you want to rent the room? We currently are checking passport/ visa, work contract, scholarship, and 3 months latest bank statements. And normally we only accept tenant's with savings more than the initial 6 months total rental cost or those ones whose rent being paid by the uni with scholarship.  Anything I can improve?

Online credit checking companies charge very little <£30.  If the tenant baulks at this they're not the type of tenants you want to be handing the keys to £1000's of pounds of property to in the first place.  Google tenant verify or similar.