UK Landlord Forum / Life

I really need advice.

Current situation.

1) half a months rent is owed
2) 12 month contract expired in June. Been rolling since.
3) Couple living there have now split up with the man refusing to leave.
4) female is waiting for him to move out as she is prepared to keep paying rent and stay there.
5) I'm receiving text messages late at night from him believing I have chosen her side and that he has legal representation now.
7) the end of the rolling month is the 17th I'm worried he will just stay and I'm worried he is trashing the place. She put down deposit not him.
7) it's starting to make me feel ill

Any advice? Please 8 need it.

Landlords do sometimes find that tenants try to use you as heavy artillery in their domestic conflict.  Don't get drawn into that and don't reply to late night paranoid texts, unless they're requesting a repair or reporting a problem with the property.

Go round and visit -- knock on the door.  Have a cup of tea with them.  If he's trashing the place, you'll soon see.  Over your cup of tea, explain that they need to pay the rent that's missing, and ask them how his search for an alternative property is going and what's the timescale for him to move out.  Explain that she'll need to sign a new tenancy in her own name when that happens.  Explain that until it does happen, they're both your tenants and they're both liable for the rent.

In law, is one joint tenant more entitled to stay than the other? If he doesn't want to leave and she doesn't want to leave, and they can't resolve it themselves, then is it really up to the landlord to pick a favourite?

They can go to court to sort it out, or one of them can serve notice that ends the tenancy for both hoping the landlord will offer a new tenancy to one of them.

So, if Alice gives notice to end the tenancy and Bob doesn't leave by the due date, can the landlord still offer a new tenancy to Alice or does Bob have to be evicted first?

I'd be half inclined to cut my losses, S21 the pair of them and let them go and throw plates at each other in someone else's kitchen.

Landlord probably can't effectively grant a new tenancy to Alice because you can't give exclusive possession to Alice if Bob is still there. Having said that though, if landlord can grant new tenancy to Alice, Alice possibly have a easier time legally excluding Bob by just excluding him without use of force, compare to a landlord who can only legally evict through court. And Bob is liable for mense profits at twice the rate of rent if he is holding over after the end of the tenancy ended by a tenant's notice to quit.

Quote from: Simon Pambin on September 07, 2019, 09:17:02 PM
I'd be half inclined to cut my losses, S21 the pair of them and let them go and throw plates at each other in someone else's kitchen.

I suspect you wouldn't be the only one.

Thanks for the replies. I am pretty much decided to S21 the both of them as I can guarantee something else will arise in the future. My concern I think he will trash the place to spite her.

He also keeps requesting a letter from me ending his tenancy. I think he needs it for a council house? So

1) he is living there
2) he's waiting on the end of tenancy from me
3) she is willing to pay but can't/won't get in house with him there.
4) if I serve a S21 I'm pretty sure there's no payments gonna be made.

On a joint tenancy, both tenants are equally responsible for the rent, regardless of who is or isn't in the property. It makes no difference to you as landlord if they had some agreement between themselves to pay half each.

What makes you think Bob is going to trash the place? It would be a criminal offence under the Criminal Damage Act. It'll also do him no favours when it comes to finding somewhere else to live.

As a single male with, presumably, no dependent children, he's going to be a long, long way down the Council's priority list, even if (when) he's made unintentionally homeless via your Section 21 or Alice's notice to terminate the tenancy.

His best chance of finding somewhere is if he's got a glowing reference from his current landlord, explaining that he always paid the rent on time and kept the place spotless but was sadly forced to find somewhere else to live when his relationship with Alice broke down. The only way he's going to get a reference like that is if he actually does keep looking after the place for the remainder of the tenancy and makes sure that, between him and Alice, the rent gets paid in full.

Thank you so much Simon. Really appreciate your reply. This is keeping me up at night.

For him to come off the tenancy. Would he have to request it in writing? Would a simply email be enough?

Either Bob or Alice can serve the notice to end the tenancy. It would probably be best if Alice actually serves the notice. It's in her interests because she doesn't want to be liable for the rent if she's not living at the property, and it's in Bob's interest because then he hasn't intentionally made himself homeless.

Notice should be in writing unless the contract says otherwise. You might find these links useful:

https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/how_to_end_a_joint_tenancy

https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/ending_a_periodic_tenancy

https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/relationship_breakdown_ending_a_joint_tenancy

Quote from: Simon Pambin on September 08, 2019, 11:27:59 AM
Notice should be in writing unless the contract says otherwise. You might find these links useful:

Notice must be in writing even if the contract says otherwise: s5(1) Protection from Eviction Act 1977.

Quote from: KTC on September 08, 2019, 05:40:09 PM
Notice must be in writing even if the contract says otherwise: s5(1) Protection from Eviction Act 1977.

Thanks: I'll never trust another word that Shelter says! 

That does make sense: if I were party to a joint tenancy and one of the other tenants pulled the plug, I'd certainly want something more tangible than a spoofable e-mail.

I've certainly come to realise that councils and Shelter are the enemy of the Landlord it seems. I work as a locksmith and have done many evictions where people have been left devastated by loss of payments where councils have advised ways of getting out of eviction. We are talking second homes for a pension not multiple homes. One council was actually advising the tenant to take the landlord to court over an EPC even though the tenant had not paid for 10 months and the Landlord was basically broke.